A Cry For Justice

Awakening the Evangelical Church to Domestic Violence and Abuse in its Midst

How many problems can you find in CBMW’s “Statement on Abuse”?

Chris Moles and I both have concerns about the Statement On Abuse which the Council on Biblical Manhood and Womanhood published in 2018. But I see more problems in CBMW’s statement than the ones Chris Moles noticed.

This post is the penultimate in my series about Chris Moles. I know that some readers are wanting the series to be over and done with. Don’t worry, it will be finished soon!

If, dear reader, you want to hone your discernment about false teaching, you can use what I am about to say as a practice exercise. If you want to do that, here is your assignment —

  1. Read CBMW’s 2018 Statement on Abuse
  2. Then listen to Clarifying our Response to Domestic Violence which is a podcast by Chris Moles. At 5:30 in the podcast, Chris starts giving his opinions about CBMW’s 2018 Statement on Abuse. He affirms some of the things CBMW says, but he also challenges some of their points and suggests ways they could improve their wording.
  3. Mentally clarify your own views—
    Did you pick up anything wrong in CBMW’s Statement on Abuse?
    If you detected flaws in CBMW’s statement, what exactly did you notice?
    Did you detect flaws in CBMW’s statement that Chris Moles did not notice?

If you have done that three-step exercise (or even if you haven’t) let me encourage you now to put your thinking caps in order to wrap your heads around the complexities of the backstory.

CBMW have published TWO Statements on Abuse

They published their first statement on abuse in 1994.
Here is a link to my critique of CBMW’s 1994 Statement on Abuse.

They published their second statement on abuse in 2018.
Here is a link to my critique of CBMW’s 2018 Statement on Abuse.

Chris Moles did not critique CBMW’s 1994 statement; but he has critiqued CBMW’s 2018 statement.

I have more concerns than Chris Moles has about CBMW’s Statement on Abuse.

Why am I bothering to tell you this? Am I just crowing about my discerment? No.

Here are my reasons for revisiting CBMW’s Statements on Abuse:

  1. CBMW’s Statements on Abuse have received little push back. I believe they need to be given more attention from those who are concerned about CBMW’s ideology. There are some folks (like me) who are not persuaded by egalitarian theology, but we are very uncomfortable with the version of “complementarianism” which CBMW has promulgated.
  2. As I’ve shown in my series about Chris Moles, I am very willing to honor Chris Moles for the things which I believe he is getting right.
  3. Chris Moles’ discernment differs from mine. By highlighting the differences, I hope to help readers work out for themselves whether and to what extent they want to consider Chris Moles as someone who is worth listening to.

Problems which I see in CBMW’s 2018 Statement on Abuse — these are problems which Chris Moles did not see.

CBMW’s definition of abuse is inadequate

They leave out coercive control by means of emotional, financial and spiritual abuse, gaslighting, isolation, micro-management of the victims’ daily lives. And they don’t mention legal / systemic abuse which abusers can also employ in their arsenal of tactics (especially when the abused woman is getting divorced from her abusive husband).

CBMW’s statement suggest that all victims of abuse are unregenerate

They talk about the abused finding healing “through the gospel”. The gospel, in its narrow sense, is given to bring the unregenerate to faith in Christ – “Repent, and believe the gospel!” (Mark 1:15). …If we take CBMW’s words in this narrow sense, they are implying that abuse victims are not regenerate, not born again, so they need to repent and come to saving faith in Christ. That is offensive to all the abused who are already true Christians.

If CBMW meant the gospel in the broader sense in which it is often used today, it would have been better if they’d said: “We believe that the church must offer tender concern and care for the abused and must help the abused to find hope and healing through Christ, the Word and the Spirit (Luke 4:18).”

CBMW are not specific about whether abusers who profess to be Christians are regenerate

They say “abusers need to…repent of their sin, and to trust in Jesus Christ alone for salvation.”

Do CBMW truly believe that abusers who profess to be Christians are actually not Christians? — I hope so; but I very much doubt it: their wording is too vague. Chris Moles doesn’t pick up on this, because he himself is vague on this point.

CBMW cite scripture in a way that implies that if a women doesn’t submit, she is being abusive

They say, “We believe that the biblical teaching on relationships between men and women does not support, but condemns abuse (Prov. 12:18; Eph. 5:25-29; Col. 3:18; 1 Tim. 3:3; Titus 1:7-8; 1 Pet. 3:7; 5:3).”

Citing Colossians 3:18 (wives submit to your husbands as is fitting in the Lord) is below the belt. CBMW are implying that when a wife doesn’t submit, she’s being abusive. This is a gross slander of women that CBMW needs to repent of.

If a wife is married to a non-abusive husband and she does not submit to a reasonable request from him, that may be unwise or imprudent on her part; she may be lacking in consideration for family harmony, etc. But if a wife is married to an abusive husband and she doesn’t submit to the abuser’s demands, she is not “being abusive”. Yet this is exactly what CBMW do when they cite Colossians 3:18 as as condemnation of abuse.

CBMW does this because it has a faulty understanding of the woman’s desire in Genesis 3:16. They claim that the woman’s desire for her husband is a desire to usurp authority over him, and they base this claim solely on one author, ironically a female author, Susan Foh, who in 1975 advanced a totally novel interpretation of Genesis 3:16.

Foh argued that just as sin crouched on the threshold, desiring to destroy Cain, and Cain was told he must overrule this temptation, so the wife desires to control her husband (by usurping his divinely appointed authority) and the husband must master her if he can.

Foh’s interpretation dovetails perfectly into the lying claim of the abusive husband (and his pastor ally) that the husband was harsh towards his wife because the wife wasn’t submissive. The perfect theological excuse for abuse!

Only if you accept Foh’s aberrant interpretation – an interpretation that no commentator had conceived of for the first 1900 years of the Christian era – do you swallow the notion that a when wife does not submit she must be abusing her husband.

Chris Moles does not seem to be aware of the far-reaching effect this misinterpretation of Genesis 3:16 has had on women who are victims of domestic abuse.

Bottom line: There is nothing abusive in a victim failing to submit to an abuser.


Since I only cited one item of Chris’s work in this post, I gave a direct link to it.  It is item S in the list of citations at the Chris Moles Digest.

Further Reading

How Susan Foh’s interpretation fed steroids to abusers.

The woman’s desire in Genesis 3:16 — let’s be consistent with the context and with actual life.


  1. Denise

    Excellent review, especially with respect to coercive control. This aspect of abuse encompasses many dynamics relationships that dwell under the “submit” umbrella and other forms of control. There is not enough emphasis on Ephesians 5:21 which states: Submit one to another and provides the complete context for the verse. I have personally never heard a preacher quote 5:21.

  2. Krikit

    The erroneous Gen. 3:16 interpretation was precisely the scriptural whip used against me again and again many years ago when I was in the midst of a covertly abusive marriage. And because I knew no scripturally better then, myself, I swallowed that choking sized lump of condemnation, hook, line, and sinker for a number of years. Doing so cost me the next 11 years of my life with Christ, so weighted down by false guilt, shame, depression, and the loss of myself (in the truest sense possible) and who I was in Christ.

    I can say one good thing about it all: because I did belong to Christ, He never left me, but was continuously my Source, even when I couldn’t recognize it. He led me to tens upon tens of authored readings (some great, some horrible), opening my eyes and heart to the truth of the evils of abusive relationships. He grew my discernment and wisdom by leaps and bounds. He solidified my certainty that I am His sheep and I hear His voice! No one, ever again, will be able to convince me otherwise! And for that alone, I am immensely grateful that He is my ABBA, and I am His child.

  3. bluebird

    The contrast between victims being unregenerate and abusers being mostly, probably, almost-certainly regenerate is what gets me. I remember reading your response to their statement a while back and it struck me then. But it still stands out to me because one of the tactics abusers employ is making their victims out to be crazy, sinful and unforgiving. They are so talented and so capable in this already! For the CBMW to come alongside of them and give them a boost in this area is infuriating.

  4. Charis

    Here are my observations:

    1) We believe abuse can be defined as any act or failure to act resulting in imminent risk, serious injury, death, physical or emotional or sexual harm, or exploitation of another person.

    “Can be” is a weak statement of belief meaning there is a lot of wiggle room. To strengthen their position, it would have been better to simply state what IS abuse: “We believe abuse IS any act….” Further, “imminent” means impending, close at hand, fast approaching. This shows a lack of understanding that abuse and the harm it generates often unfolds over the course of many months and years the damage it does builds – like a disease. The effects may not always be seen immediately but the result is most certainly devastating. “Of another person” is not painted with exact detail but left vague and depersonalized. For many or most of us, we were not just “another person.” We were an intimate partner, a wife, a daughter, a sister – family. It is an injustice to distance the abuse by stating the harm is done to “other people.” Their first statement of belief is woefully weak and lacking in insight.

    2) We condemn all forms of physical, sexual and / or verbal abuse.

    While this second point is stated stronger than the first it is in direct opposition to it. The first point never clarified verbal abuse as a type of abuse (of course neither did they mention psychological, cultural, spiritual or financial abuse – among others). And, oddly, this second statement does not condemn emotional abuse – which they did list originally. While it sounds noble to make such a statement, they don’t indicate what good comes from condemning abuse. What is the action taken? What changes to theology or practice? What lessons learned? What grass roots movement do they propose? This second statement adds no value.

    Skip #3

    4) We believe that abuse is not only a sin but is also a crime. It is destructive and evil. Abuse is a hallmark of the devil and is in direct opposition to the purposes of God. Abuse must not to be tolerated in the Christian community.

    [Typos in point 4) quoted above are in the original document. What Charis’ typed or copied matches the original document. Editors.]

    If abuse is a crime, where is the urging for pastors and lay persons to report to authorities? The call to right past grievances? To go the extra mile in pursing justice? What are the “purposes of God”? This is important – especially in the wounded minds, hearts and souls of the abused women reading their treatise. And especially because their next statement will give them a sliver of hope. If abuse is “not to be tolerated” in their community….how? How is it to be eradicated? What actions are to be taken? This group is soft on answers, practical guidance and reality-based insight. If the abused woman reads this and stands up for herself, she likely puts herself in danger. If a pastor reads this, he is left empty-handed and without resources – and is likely to put those in his care in danger. This fourth statement, above all others, reads like a parade banner: all show and no substance; just for pretty.

    5) We believe that the local church and Christian ministries have a responsibility to establish safe environments; to execute policies and practices that protect against any form of abuse; to confront abusers and to protect the abused, which includes the responsibility to report abuse to civil authorities.

    This point lacks a definition of “safe.” Most think in terms of physical safety when, in fact, it means so much more: emotional safety, freedom to share your story & needs, spiritual safety (judgement), healing safety through expression (tears, rants, art, music, movement, etc). Sadly, most churches are the furthest from safe spaces. This should be a call to safety with great care and definition about what that means and what it looks like….and what needs to change in order to make that happen is: a call to repentance.

    Before churches can “execute policies and practices” they must first write them! Many (most?) churches lack a strong infrastructure with well-written policies & procedures. This statement doesn’t help; it is vague (again) and lacking in resources. How are churches to write a policy that “protects against any form of abuse?” Is this reasonable? Practical? Where is their guidance toward an established, credible authority to assist them in this area? “Any form of abuse”? Are churches going to craft a written policy protecting married women from emotional abuse that happens in the privacy of their home?! I find that unlikely….and unreasonable. If that is truly what CBMW intends, they have overstepped their bounds here. While I do believe that churches should have well-written policies in place for abuse that happens on their property or at the hands of staff members – policies for protecting against abuse that happens between congregants in the privacy of their home is a civil matter.

    “To confront abusers and protect the abused” is another weak statement lacking in mechanics. How? How to do this? When to do this? What are the ways to protect the victim without further endangering her? What is meant by confronting the abuser? Will that threaten the safety of the victim? Is it smart? Is it necessary? Should it be done at all?

    This fifth statement is absurd and unhelpful.

    6) We believe that church and ministry leaders have a special obligation to report abuse to civil authorities. Moreover, these leaders are responsible for knowing the laws of their state about reporting the suspicion or accusation of child and spousal abuse, and for following those laws in good faith.

    “A special obligation?” What does that mean? Why special? If they are referring to mandated reporting – then they need to spell that out here; with distinct clarity!

    They erase their first sentence with the second; completely duck-and-cover, camouflaging over everything they just said by blame shifting. Although CBMW states they believe ministry leaders have duty to report….they will trust those leaders to read and follow the laws of their state “in good faith.” Just as they haven’t been doing. This 6th statement is hollow.

    7) We believe that the church must offer tender concern and care for the abused and must help the abused to find hope and healing through the gospel. The church should do all it can to provide ongoing counseling and support for the abused. The wounds of abuse run deep and so patience and mercy are needed over the long-haul as the church cares for the abused.

    “The church….help the abused to find hope and healing through the gospel”, why not trained trained trauma counselors instead of the church? Most of us have been re-victimized by the church and have a lack of trust in what is being taught. Again, as before, there is no definition here. What is “gospel” to them? And….do they mean to suppose that all the abused are lacking in the gospel? Do we all need more gospel in our lives due to the nature of our abuse? Is the message here that all I need is more Jesus, more salvation, more repentance from my sin and things would get better? There is condemnation in this statement to the abused. It is slight and it is there. The “hope and healing through the gospel” is found in the cross; the saving work of Jesus, He is my Hope and my Healing. Thus, the natural conclusion is that the abused (I am one of them) needs salvation, needs the cross and the church….so, abuse must have been my sin or caused by my sin. This is false, false, false. Shame on them!

    “Patience and mercy are needed over the long-haul” – am I so burdensome that I require patience? Perhaps. What have I done that is so egregious that I require mercy?! Or what do they anticipate that I will do to require mercy? Do they expect me to commit some moral failure? To turn to sinful means of coping “over the long-haul”? To sin in my expressions of anger? Why mercy?! Why not Grace! This seventh statement condemns the wrong person.

    8) We believe abusers need to confess their crimes both to civil and church authorities, to repent of their sin, and to trust in Jesus Christ alone for salvation and forgiveness from their sin.

    “To repent of their sin”, but they do not define or give description of what repent means. And here we are today, stuck in the revolving door of scandals > brief recovery > restored ministry. Where is the statement of consequences for actions? Where is the statement of justice? Where is the statement of removal from the flock? This eighth statement is sadly lacking and silent.

    9) We believe that by the power of God’s Spirit, the Christian church can be an instrument of God’s love and healing for those involved in abusive relationships and an example of wholeness in a fractured, broken world.

    “For those involved in abusive relationships” puts equal blame on both the abused and the abuser. This heaps coals of shame, doubt, condemnation on the victim and sends her back into a tailspin of confusion and will take her twice as long to risk venturing out of the fog, seek help, trust a new resource.

    “The Christian church can be an instrument of God’s love and healing….and example of wholeness.” It is not about the church. It is all about Jesus. CBMW misses the mark here as do so many slick worship videos and marketing packages. It is not about the seminar, the author, the 5-steps to something better, you or me. It is Jesus. Only Him. His Spirit. God. He is love; He is healing. He is the example of love in a “fractured, broken world.”

    This ninth, final statement negates all the others and reveals that CBMW has no true position on abuse.

    • Finding Answers


  5. Now Free (formerly struggling to be free)

    Today I have taken another step in my healing journey from a 20 year abusive relationship. Inside I rejoice but only in part as I also mourn as I feel sad my abuser still cannot see truth. even when it was glaringly apparent on a few occasions to others and they spoke up only to receive heavy ridicule. On one occasion I had to close a worship group rehearsal due to the way things exploded.

    I rejoice that I need no longer feel guilty for the stance I took to move away or to divorce, but especially for the times I stood up and spoke up; times I tried to get help from family and friends and church. I feel no longer guilty for venting my pain or my concerns. It gives me no pleasure in saying anything at all. It was never out of spite or to bring pain to anyone. I was not listened to, certainly admonished, belittled, made to feel guilty as if I had sinned and certainly not supported, whenever I did ever say anything that was happening to me. I even feel almost guilty writing this. I’ve often wrote in reply to blogs here and just wiped them for that reason. I was often told by my abuser that I was being abusive simply for speaking up when things were being said or done that were wrong and saying it as it is. I was the abuser simply because I said that I would not tolerate any more of the nonsensical goings on in the home.

    Meeting often with the playing victim mentality, silence and shutting away for days or weeks, and further bouts of extreme madness and out of control words and deeds when eventually emerging. These times I can only describe as almost to point of [being] like ‘a woman possessed’. Frightening at times that it could easily spill into fatal consequences sequences.

    Scared and confused I’ve carried false guilt far too long, despite in my heart of heart knowing all I did was try to put into practice 1 Corinthians 13 and each day took it as a new day and “held no record of wrongs”.

    Despite all I did I could never win the battle and it was not long before I realised I was almost dead inside and out. I’ve written here before of what spurned me to take decisive action.

    These last few days have been an eye opener as I have always been told I was evil and twisted and certainly not Christian as from time to time I took my stand and spoke up and voiced my concern. When finally my church pastor was told I was talking of separating and eventual divorce, then a whole new type of abuse emerged. This whole Chris Moles’ thing has angered and triggered stuff again for me.

    All I was told was “hold on there’s hope.” I tried to tell my story but was talked over with reams of Bible verses and a lot of false accusations. I even tried to say “Put your Bible away – I’m not stupid! I have studied it at Bible college and have pastoral qualifications and preachers licence etc – don’t you think I know what God says?” Despite trying to speak I was not listened to – they had their agenda. Get me out of leadership, put me away in another church and hope someone else will help us get back together. They certainly were not wanting to get involved.

    I remember standing to my feet in anger and saying, “Would you say a man should stay with his wife if she is abusing him sexually, physically or mentally, what is your answer to that?” I said it in front of my wife and his wife [pastor’s wife?] too. I wanted him to realise he was putting me in grave danger. They had no answer and were stumped, and just said divorce was wrong. I never got to give the reason why I felt I needed to separate and end the marriage.

    I said, “I have repeatedly over the last five years specifically asked for help and all I got was prayed for, for strength. Why did you not help me?” Their answer was “Yes, you have done everything in your own strength and look where it has got you.” They hurled accusations that it was all my sinfulness that caused this and went further to say that any wonder the church is in a mess. Any wonder we have no blessing and things are struggling. I felt so guilty that I could have been the one who hindered God working even when I felt I was not. I was then blamed for specific meetings that everyone felt so encouraged by and blessed by the worship and yet I was told on this visit by the pastor and his wife to my home, that there was a real “heavy presence in those meetings”. I was screaming inside ‘that’s because my wife was in to disrupt and use the special meeting platform as further abuse and play victim to manipulate you all. Having said that no one apparently felt these meetings were bad. In fact very much the opposite, they were deeply encouraged when asked by my parents. There was another agenda, it was made up to push a point. But I had no more fight as it was pointless and I just silently cried in my soul. I have felt for years I was the reason for a lot of problems in the church. They still remain despite both me and pastor no longer there.

    My pastoral leader had almost in two days changed from avid supporters of ministry and worship that I had led for many years to now saying I lived and did everything on my own strength. My answer was that it is only down to God and my deep faith that I’ve had the strength to endure this past 20 years of continual abuse. I could never have come through what I have without relying on God and certainly I could not have continued to try and put it to one side as I worshipped, preached and ministered into people’s lives. That most certainly was not of me and very much the Holy Spirit. There is no way I could have had the strength otherwise let alone the words etc. I can’t begin to tell you how hurt and confused I have been and searching my own heart as if I am guilty and still saying “no this is very wrong”.

    Their answer to everything was, “You need to pray for more strength – there is hope”. I was furious inside, but I was civil but I remained standing. I think they got the message that it was time to leave my home. I felt awful in doing that alone.

    I felt extremely violated misunderstood and very much abused by the pastor and his wife, who I had revered and strongly supported through hard times (often at great cost personally) and worked very closely with.

    I was read scripture after scripture and often it was quoted well out of context. It’s a time I will never forget. I was spoken to but never once was I heard as they did not listen or even ask me anything. It was totally a telling off like in a headmaster’s office. I felt totally let down by the very people I trusted the most.

    I was basically told I was not wanted. That hurt deeply as I had grown up since a child in the church and served faithfully in many avenues of leadership within it for most of my teens to adult life. Over 30 years was suddenly gone. No support – nothing. The congregation were told I just wanted to move on. Everything was hushed up. Many thought I just needed a break and expected me back. They were flabbergasted and extremely upset and hurt when I handed in my resignation a short while later. That in itself was extremely sad for everyone and I feel guilty for hurting the people I cared for and loved. I was involved in two other churches that I regularly ministered in. Needless to say I was never contacted and have never heard from anyone in them. I can’t describe how outcast I feel even now, but I know God understands and just look at how Jesus Himself was ridiculed mocked and misunderstood even to the point of death. So I know I’m understood and still loved by Him.

    I feel like an outcast also as I walk the streets. I’m forever watching….just in case. In fear of meeting people who at one time ran to befriend. They now shun like I was the devil himself. Out of fear on their part to engage perhaps out of embarrassment or of not knowing what to say. All the while I’m screaming inside, “Hi I am the same person who was your friend and ministered into your lives many times. I’m same person don’t judge me or run.”

    I feel sad for them as I’m sure it’s awkward for them but I’m extremely sad they can’t put that aside for one hurting or someone who cared for them and their situation all their lives. I am very alone in my freedom. I lost all my friends bar one who I see once a year, and people I dearly loved and no one has offered any help not even a kind word. Only one lady in church (who wrote to me and thanked me and wished me every blessing).

    I know I’m not paranoid but part of me wishes you could just stand up in front of all you know and the truth be out and done with, but we all know it’s never going to happen.
    I’m too private a person but also it hurts too much to relive.
    So yes I hide now mostly.
    Yes I have a ‘mask!’ So often I told congregations to take off ‘masks’ that hindered advancing for God or being real with God (as if we could ever hide from Him)! But I know now at least for me and many others we need our safe place – and we need to be safe.

    In response to realising that when I resisted (when I was cornered or mustered some inner strength, or basically really I just could not take any more) I had to snap back not with sin, but a firm stance.

    I often liken it to a wild animal trapped in a corner and facing death. (I once was literally naked and in a foetal position and felt exactly that as I was being towered over and being given in-your-face-tirade of verbal abuse.) When I took a stand I was right away confronted with the victim cry that I was the abuser and all sorts of charades took place including threatening authorities, etc. I was threatened in a wild rage once with doors almost taken off their hinges with the fire brigade to bust down a toilet door, where I was hiding (fingers in ears) cowering for safety. It almost seems farcical now but it was deadly serious and dangerous at the time. I spent many a night in all-night supermarket carparks and motorway service stations. Thankfully I had a few nearby. Sneaking in only before dawn for my work uniform and run out.

    For years I have felt false guilt for standing up at times and speaking up against what was happening. For years I have felt that speaking to others or venting was ungodly and was full of shame.

    I often at first spoke up for myself, but it only met with lies and often that I was not loving and kind and that I had changed. I knew the truth, I knew my scripture, and in my spirit I knew I was not to blame and that this whole relationship was mentally crazy and something was definitely not right. I was giving 100% and was getting met with weirdness and even to this day things I cannot explain or understand. It certainly was not love.

    I still get a lot of harassment from time to time despite two years separated and soon final divorce. I can see so clearly the power struggle still. Nothing has changed in the heart. They have even taken control of the move to court for divorce papers. I had not the money at present but had intended once I had saved up. This is from a person who very much stated divorce was an anathema to them and fought hard and fast against it on religious grounds. Seems financial things out-weighed that suddenly.

    I just wanted to share a revelation moment and another part of healing. It’s a process but then aren’t we all until we reach heaven. I hope this encourages others here. You are not on your own here. Sorry if this is long so much in my heart.

    • UPDATE Sept 2021: I have come to believe that Jeff Crippen does not practise what he preaches. He vilely persecuted an abuse victim and spiritually abused many other people in the Tillamook congregation. Go here to read the evidence. Jeff has not gone to the people that he spiritually and emotionally abused. He has not apologised to them, let alone asked for their forgiveness.


      Hi Now Free. Whew! It’s great to hear that you are shedding so much false guilt. 🙂

      Since your comment was so long, I took out your song lyrics. It’s okay to post them, but please do so in a separate comment. Thanks.

      I think you would enjoy listening to Jeff Crippen’s two sermons series – Domestic Violence And Abuse, and Wise As Serpents. You can find them in the top menu under the Sermons tab.

      • Now Free (formerly struggling to be free)

        Thanks Barbara I’m sorry my blog was long. Yesterday is [the] first [time] I listened to a sermon in over two years. It was one of Jeff’s first ones on the list re Galatians 5 etc. I tried to share it with my dad but my sister was very defensive listening and glaring at me in the background, every time I said something about it. I know there’s still a lot on their part they do not fully understand. I just closed up right away as I knew they were not fully interested. Church is far too important to them.
        I enjoyed Jeff’s sermon and will listen through the various series when I can, as that first one gave me a lot of insight and encouragement.
        Sorry again for being too long-winded. 😦

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